53 replies to this topic

[alchefuck]

Stop making shit up. Costs were not "Quadrupled". The change means that people won't have Coagulated Spells piling up in storage unused like before the change. You can still get more than enough Spells to enchant what few boots you manage to convert.

Spells comes later, first need Temporal Crystals to get boots. To get those a player must end the instance killing Root of Corruption and Amdarais: how do if it's almost impossible to kill them? Do we have to make server vs single MvP raids? ... Try to be reasonable and don't attempt to move the discussion to irrilevant aspects of the thread (in other words: who gives a fuck about Coagulants since you can get all you want even just killing common mobs inside OGH?).

[Lyka]

It's not impossible though. Stop trying to do end game things with no reductions.

[alchefuck]

It's not impossible, I hope. If it was impossible would be totally ridiculous, wouldn't be it?

Give same chances to end game things to every player; not a day easy as hell just for few ones (since people can even fill their storages with it and sell doubles to others) and that after almost impossible to acquire. This is what I call balance and equality.

[Terpsichore]

First of all, Hazy Forest isn't meant for levels 99, no idea where you pulled that from, the instance is meant to be done during the final stages of new world questline and is full of level 145~ mobs with up  to 122k hp, that's not level 99 content. Lost Dragon is fairly easy as well, as long as you aren't trying to facetank earthquake on a bow ranger (you're supposed to run out of it), get someone to tank it to make it easier. By the way, it also gives pretty good EXP now.

 

And as you yourself mentioned, Temporal Boots are endgame content, so are the new zones, not something you're supposed to easily solo after getting your Mora set (though it's still possible to a degree).

 

As for the boots, spells were never the deciding factor, it was the rng and crystals, which remains unchanged (I lowered the spell costs a bit though). Nobody is going to deal x3 times as much damage by wearing them either and they're disabled in WoE and BGs.

 

Root of Corruption wasn't buffed, it was just fixed to have correct attack and vision range so you can't effortlessly snipe it form maximum range anymore, it's endgame content so you need certain basic stuff, such as reductions and elemental cards.

There are parties clearing the instance every day.

 

 

To make it short, you aren't supposed to solo the entirety of the game on your fresh ranger.

Calling getting basic reductions and a pasana card impossible is pretty absurd as well, everyone has the same "chance" since nothing is stopping you from farming basic gear.

 

 

I welcome valid complaints but most of what you wrote is just plain wrong. You also mentioned the importance of maintaining a good economy yet you suggest something that goes against it, making endgame gear easily obtainable and common.

[Neri]

Stop making shit up. Costs were not "Quadrupled". The change means that people won't have Coagulated Spells piling up in storage unused like before the change. You can still get more than enough Spells to enchant what few boots you manage to convert.

 

*Unless you are a lucky fuck and manage to +7 and succeed at every enchant all the time.

 

**Which I am not, where's my final enchant booties ;_;

 

Not anymore you can't, average coagulated spell haul for a party is about 5 each from completing it a bunch of times, at that rate it would take over a month to get 160 coagulated spells (the total cost of every enchant plus the final one).  Add in the +7 refine needed to exchange the boots and the failure chances of enchanting the 4th slot, you're looking at something that has been turned into a way too excessive nerf.  Not to mention people who completed it a bunch of times, like myself, before the nerf have a huge advantage compared to everyone else now.

[Terpsichore]

I reduced the costs but they won't go back to their old values since since our success chances are high and the final enchant isn't random, there has to be more demand than supply of spells.

[Neri]

Reduced the costs to what?

 

Success chances are far higher on iRO/kRO with the same costs as before the nerf, they don't require +7 Temporal Boots to exchange and you've already buffed Root/Amdarais with random skills far above their official server counterparts.  Making "end-game" gear excessively hard to obtain isn't good for a healthy economy either.

[alchefuck]

First of all, Hazy Forest isn't meant for levels 99, no idea where you pulled that from, the instance is meant to be done during the final stages of new world questline and is full of level 145~ mobs with up  to 122k hp, that's not level 99 content. Lost Dragon is fairly easy as well, as long as you aren't trying to facetank earthquake on a bow ranger (you're supposed to run out of it), get someone to tank it. By the way, it also gives pretty good EXP now.

Level requirement to access the instance is level 99: if you can access it you can do it, else the level requirement would be higher. Simple.
 

And as you yourself mentioned, Temporal Boots are endgame content, so are the new zones, not something you're supposed to easily solo after getting your Mora set (though it's still possible to a degree).
As for the boots, spells were never the deciding factor, it was the rng and crystals, which remains unchanged (I lowered the spell costs a bit though). Nobody is going to deal x3 times as much damage by wearing them either and they're disabled in WoE and BGs.
Root of Corruption wasn't buffed, it was just fixed to have correct attack and vision range so you can't effortlessly snipe it form maximum range anymore, it's endgame content so you need certain basic stuff, such as reductions and elemental cards.
There are parties clearing the instance every day.
To make it short, you aren't supposed to solo the entirety of the game on your fresh ranger.
Calling getting basic reductions and a pasana card impossible is pretty absurd as well, everyone has the same "chance" since nothing is stopping you from farming basic gear.

Where did you readen I want to solo? When I solo? Did you ever played with me? I go solo just to farm common cards and gears, boring activities. I do party even just to weak MvPs like Orc Hero: can be solo'd in 20 seconds but I prefer the true RO spirit: play in party.
 

I welcome valid complaints but most of what you wrote is just plain wrong. You also mentioned the importance of maintaining a good economy yet you suggest something that goes against it, making endgame gear easily obtainable and common.

This is your opinion: still didn't answered about the bug abuse of Hazy Forest or why didn't simply remove or stop a too easy quest for Temporal Boots (wiping and refunding the item when the thing is catched). What I said, but you won't understand and consider, is: endgame gears have to be hard to acquire to everyone, you can't allow a day to get it in a week simply soloing and then later in months having to organize huge party for raids. I want to have the same exact chances to get a gear as everybody, not have to nuke overboosted stuff that needs a 20 players party while other people was given the chance to solo nuking MvPs close to Poring stats (while they should have worked - as I just said - in a party of 20 people). Got it now? You released something easy as hell, somebody "abused" it, and now is beyond as it should be ... but the negligence (Admin team)/abuse (players) stay.

[Terpsichore]

Alright then, form a party of level 99 players (after completing all the required new world quests to access the bifrost field and enter the instance) and try killing the mobs inside, see how far you get.

 

I'm not going to comment further on a bug here, it isn't relevant to this discussion either.

 

 

It seems like you're making up things again, the instance was never "easy" and bosses never had "poring stats", nobody had the chance to "solo" those mvps either, also, party limit is 12 players, not 20.

 

 

I'm going to bed now, hope to see some more valid feedback when I wake up.

[Sylphid]

Level requirement to access the instance is level 99: if you can access it you can do it, else the level requirement would be higher. Simple.

Okay, then I'm off to beat endless tower on my level 50 merchant.

Seriously, level requirement has nothing to do with what level you are able to clear the instance at.

[ViniciusZ]

Stop making shit up. Costs were not "Quadrupled". The change means that people won't have Coagulated Spells piling up in storage unused like before the change. You can still get more than enough Spells to enchant what few boots you manage to convert.

 

*Unless you are a lucky fuck and manage to +7 and succeed at every enchant all the time.

 

**Which I am not, where's my final enchant booties ;_;

 

People are doing "B> Coaguled Spell" every 15 minutes. How much time you spend online?

"The change means that people won't have Coagulated Spells piling up in storage unused like before the change"

So you think everyone had a thousand of coaguled spells on storage before the change?

That's one of the problems of the server, always thinking in the ppl who have better stuff (1% of ppl). Now few ppl have huge advantages.

And 1st of all remember you're a party of staff team, stop get rude with ppl. If someone is doing criticism it has a reason to do this.

[ViniciusZ]

Alright then, form a party of level 99 players (after completing all the required new world quests to access the bifrost field and enter the instance) and try killing the mobs inside, see how far you get.

 

I'm not going to comment further on a bug here, it isn't relevant to this discussion either.

 

 

It seems like you're making up things again, the instance was never "easy" and bosses never had "poring stats", nobody had the chance to "solo" those mvps either, also, party limit is 12 players, not 20.

 

 

I'm going to bed now, hope to see some more valid feedback when I wake up.

 

Make it unsoloable is understandable (ppl can abuse farming his stuffs). Btw it is way harder than it, even with tank he do huge attack/AoE/Stone/insta kill too easy.

The instance nid to be balance for low lvl to do in party (w/ tanker/buff/DD all together). But I really doubt low lvl can do it with Eden Gears right now...

I'd suggest you to remove farming abuse by huge lower his drop chances, btw make him easier.

And before anyone talk it is for my "own benefity", I already did it w/ all my alts.

Edited by ViniciusZ, 05 February 2015 - 04:26 PM.

[alchefuck]

Sleeping is also a good solution ... as good as haughtiness and not talk about bugs you won't fix.

Let's wait for more valid feedbacks while the server sinks in a sea of shit.

Good luck.

[Innomite]

...

 

So what do you guys want?

[ViniciusZ]

...

 

So what do you guys want?

 

Someone want to ppl talk... good to hear it.

 

- Rebalance Lost Dragon (make it easier and lower the drop rates, which was the reason for overbuff him);

- Rebalance buffed MvPs (random add skills/cast&cd times isn't good for the bussiness);

- Rebalance cost of Temporal Boots and Old GH instance (give the players a fair chance to have it).

Also I have sure I'm forgeting something.

[Syncope]

 

...

 

So what do you guys want?

 

Someone want to ppl talk... good to hear it.

 

- Rebalance Lost Dragon (make it easier and lower the drop rates, which was the reason for overbuff him);

- Rebalance buffed MvPs (random add skills/cast&cd times isn't good for the bussiness);

- Rebalance cost of Temporal Boots and Old GH instance (give the players a fair chance to have it).

Also I have sure I'm forgeting something.

 

Look at this pvm nerd. The fuck do you even mean by these.

 

 

 

Sleeping is also a good solution ... as good as haughtiness and not talk about bugs you won't fix.

Let's wait for more valid feedbacks while the server sinks in a sea of shit.

Good luck.

 

Another random buttmad pvm nerd.

Edited by Syncope, 05 February 2015 - 06:43 PM.

[ViniciusZ]

 

 

...

 

So what do you guys want?

 

Someone want to ppl talk... good to hear it.

 

- Rebalance Lost Dragon (make it easier and lower the drop rates, which was the reason for overbuff him);

- Rebalance buffed MvPs (random add skills/cast&cd times isn't good for the bussiness);

- Rebalance cost of Temporal Boots and Old GH instance (give the players a fair chance to have it).

Also I have sure I'm forgeting something.

 

Look at this pvm nerd. The fuck do you even mean by these.

 

 

 

Sleeping is also a good solution ... as good as haughtiness and not talk about bugs you won't fix.

Let's wait for more valid feedbacks while the server sinks in a sea of shit.

Good luck.

 

Another random buttmad pvm nerd.

 

 

It's SUGGESTIONs. You even read them? I think most of ppl aren't happy with last changes and actual gameplay.

As you see I'm not asking for my own benefit.

btw srry best man of the world, but getting unmannerly with ppl by non reason will changes nothing.

Hope I find a better human when I find you again...

[Syncope]

Really?. I thought it was more of whining, moaning and bitching than actually suggesting. My bad, I could hardly understand your English.

[FlashCombo]

Now with temporal boots spell cost being reduced within the next days (its weekend soon, easily to foresee a small patch day), i think most complains are already solved.

 

Something like this cannot be properly tested by admins to foresee the current outcome. You cannot expect the admins to play their own server for 1 month, farming the instance and then see : "hey, its a little bit too easy and fast. So lets make it harder and a longer process to make sure not everyone and their mother has those ENDGAME GEARS within a month".

 

I agree that player should not be abused as teh play/test field of the admins with every major change that wasnt being tested internally first. But they are just humans, they cant know everything (or foresee). People are quick to jump to conclusions. Try to put yourself in their shoes sometimes. You want to make endgame stuff fair and not cheese easy. We didnt have any Temporal boots in our 3~4 man party in our first 10~ Old Glast heim clears and it went just fine. We didnt use any temporal boots for our first beelze, ifrit, morroc kills or verus/bifrost/fire basin/nightmare eden quests. If we can do it, other people can do the same. We leveled with 15x rates, before Eden boards were boosted. Giving 1% exp per quest once you hit almost max level. Do we complain now that every now player makes it to max within a few days? No, we dont. But it is essentially the same argument you bring up. "There are changes now, that give a certain group an advatange over others". The first players to join a server WILL ALWAYS BE AT AN ADVANTAGE. Because they joined earlier than you guys. And they had to go through changes as much as people who joined 2 weeks ago.

 

Every Private server changes its content (or should) over the course of times. Things are bound to happen to the balance. Yea, there were some things that annoy me aswell. Such as certain sorcs running around with +13 gear, because back then +13 was basically "100% guaranteed" as long as you used HD ores. Now were behind in gears. But that doesnt stop us. We are also annoyed by the MVP Buffs that make us change strategies again and again. And trust me. We always go to the admin and tell her how we feel. We give actual feedback and not just sit in prontera spamming #main how shit the server is.

 

Just my 2 cents.

 

Now for actual proposed changes and opinions to current suggestions:

 

- Rebalance Lost Dragon (make it easier and lower the drop rates, which was the reason for overbuff him);

- Rebalance buffed MvPs (random add skills/cast&cd times isn't good for the bussiness);

- Rebalance cost of Temporal Boots and Old GH instance (give the players a fair chance to have it).

 

1. I can agree with this change. To be honest, we never had any problems with this guy. we noticed he wasnt soloable anymore after his buff. But with just a second person, a tank, we killed him everytime without problems.

Now, not everyone plays like us, not everyone has a friend around. Not everyone is in a guild and not everyone hhas the guts to ask and search for parties. And sadly you cannot make content good for everyone. If we make it easier, it will definitely help new players, i agree. I think a slight nerf to this guy wouldnt hurt, but definitely not the same strawberry cake he was before. As for his valuable drops..eh. Nothing is 100%, except a shitty gold ring. Even the OCA is a 1 outta 3. Aka 33% to get. Is this farmable? I dont know. The instance is annoying and killing this guy at the current level for a 33% chance of an OCA. I would rather farm the cards i need. Will probably go faster and save me alot of time. Not even worth for his ygg drops, piss low chance. If you want to farm him for his drops. Go ahead. I see no logic behind it tho. Btw Lost dragon was level 135 pre-nerf. How will any lvl 99 kill him, my friend? The access level means nothing. This content was made for 120~140 in mind, as far as i have seen on officials.

TL;DR: A slight nerf to this guy to make him more appealing for parties wouldnt hurt. His drop chances are low and not worth farming anyway. Scale the EXP with the reduced HP/Difficulty.

 

2. MVPs are fine, except for the Teleport on Idle bullshit. Endgame content requires a strong party with decent gears, or a great party of strong few individuals. I havent seen anyone solo Beelze yet. Now with the Kaupe addition you cant cheese MVps anymore. Such as valkyrie, ifrit and morroc. I really like this change. I love playing sura, but with these warper friendly times, a change was needed to make the content not trivial because of how easy it is to asura mvps on the entrance of their level. I can whole heartly say, that once you are max or near max level and got some proper PVE cards, you can clear any content as long as you use what the game offers to you. A WW Ranger with no cards or gears + a Steel Body tank in eden gears will not be able to handle it anymore. Changelog would be very well welcomed. Low level mvps may be completely bias level. Personally i like them buffed. Because with the 175 content they really turned into Arrow Storm or Asura bitches and their loot is way to valuable. To be fair. Once you hit max level with decent gears you can still solo most of them without effort. For leveling you can still use low tier mvps, such as Eddga, Phree or Maya if you have the party for it. I dont think MVPs were ever designed to be solo content for new palyers. They shouldnt be, they wont be. The random attack/aggro bullshit makes it really hard at the moment tho for new players to tackle low content MVPs. (Especially Eddga needs various skils to be tanked and DPS'd. Right now, without LP and Steel body, SW'd Dedicated Priest and a Long Range Sniper i dont see anyone killing this guy in a proper party setup. Good Luck!

TL:DR: Remove random Teleport Crap. Keep Endgame MVPs strong. Low Tier MVPs are up to bias. Some like it strong, some like it weak. MVPs are not meant to be solo-able in general. Cant make everyone happy. Bring friends/party.

 

3. Terp already said that the spellcost will be reduced with the next small patch/maintenace. Aside from that i suggest adding another few hours of cool down to the instance. im coming from a half biased opinion here. Lowering Spell cost + adding a longer CD to the instance gives players more breathing room to try other content and go for other valauble drops or goals. Right now were going OGH day after day and we barely have time for anything else. Now you could say "then dont go". But sadly there are still people who need the crystals and spells to get their boots in our group, so were kinda "forced" to do it. Also i dont think many people are farming this instance as hardcore as us few nubs, if any at all. A 36 hour cool down would give more breathing room in trying out other stuff, without really affecting anyone. Do you really go in there every 23 hours? Probably not. With the reduced spell cost coming up it will create a balance between Time/Reward. Hopefully it will not be a low as before, because that was seriously way to easy. a 12 man party, generates about 40 crystals and 70~80 spells per run. That is atleast one full enchanted temporal boot attempt per day. Way to easy, way to fast.

 

4. Spell Damage 2 high. Not really. I have compared elemental damage here, with how it is on iRO (if you want screens or videos @Psor @Anyotherprooforgtfoperson, please send me a PM and ill provide it) with another person.

Theres 2 major things that come into mind. Spell Damage seems crazy, because you are naked or have 0 Hard MDEF. Secondly, water ball is bugged, really. It is way out of proportions and im sure the admins are working on a permanent fix, but it isnt always so easy. However, when we tested Bifrost tower monsters hitting for 1k~1.5k x 5 fire bolts. We saw that its exactly the same as on iRO. The moment i put on some reductions, it went down to 2.5k per firebolt, easily potable and healable. The waterball was always a problem and that was my main issue from the  beginning. However waterball damage was highly reduced by terp with the last mainteance. Swordfish and other monsters barely deal any damage with it anymore. Even without wearing a water armor. There may be some monsters she overlooked and im sure we can tone down some early level monsters that eden wants you to kill. But aside from that, it seems to be fine. As for the MATK inconsistency with MVPS. Yes we have noticed Valkyrie dealing 74 dmg per LoV tick. Something is definitely off, but the MVPs are still a challenge, so for now i dont think its bad. Getting hard-MDEF early is bar impossible so thats why things hit crazy early. And ofc people rush levels, not reduction gears.

 

5. People comparing MVPS to officials and how easy shit is there. Stop doing it. just stop. Officials are not privat servers. Officials dont have healers, tool dealers, warpers and all these custom items in every town. It is impossible to compare officials to privat servers. You can only take stock/base values from them, thats it. On officials everyone is overgeared with gears that are farmed by bots and zeny traders. Everyone can pay a few bucks for easy +12 upgraded weapons that trivialize any content. Chippy and his Super novice could probably kill wounded morroc on officials. This broken they are. Do not compare them, just dont.

 

Sorry for long text. But i care.

[NiHZ]

 

5. People comparing MVPS to officials and how easy shit is there. Stop doing it. just stop. Officials are not privat servers. Officials dont have healers, tool dealers, warpers and all these custom items in every town. It is impossible to compare officials to privat servers. You can only take stock/base values from them, thats it. On officials everyone is overgeared with gears that are farmed by bots and zeny traders. Everyone can pay a few bucks for easy +12 upgraded weapons that trivialize any content. Chippy and his Super novice could probably kill wounded morroc on officials. This broken they are. Do not compare them, just dont.